Hi all, a quick post that I will be editing later to make it easier to listen to. Here is Bro Joe Tale in the DZMM interview.
UPDATE:
I've tried to edit the sound levels to make them easier to listen to. The first ones uploaded were a bit blown out. Sorry about that.
Part 1
http://www.zshare.net/audio/10949609da17725d/
Part 2
http://www.zshare.net/audio/10949849243c2769/
I've retained the old versions here, just so we can keep track of how many people have listened to it.
Part 1
http://www.zshare.net/audio
Part 2
http://www.zshare.net/audio/10874081c6536811/
Monday, April 21, 2008
Joe Tale on the Radio
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![Vatican Letter 3-15-08 [Card Rylko to Bishop Reyes]](http://bp3.blogger.com/_lnnQP8ztSnM/SAt76raYssI/AAAAAAAAAnk/GNYFgfZwFoE/s1600-h/letters_0003.jpg){kind=link}
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![Vatican Letter 3-11-08 [Tampered, circulated by FFL 4-13-08]](http://bp1.blogger.com/_lnnQP8ztSnM/SBrEUYQARFI/AAAAAAAAAos/zEZqlwZ4D0Q/s1600-h/letters_0004_ffl.jpg){kind=link}
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44 comments:
Well we've heard what the brothers said on the radio interview.
Now let's read an opinion on Phil Daily Inquirer and with it, I submit this comment:
Suggestion to Clergy (No. 1 attention to Bishop G. Reyes) and FFL who believe that CFC and GK are over-emphasizing its social work... read Inquirer column (dtd April 22, 2008)of Conrado de Quiros titled "Sayings" and refresh your minds by going to a place where it is quiet and really discern with deep prayer and scripture how you have maligned the humble work of GK volunteers, the very people who help enable the poor to see Christ and eventually follow him.
Then to those responsible in the Clergy and their biased supporters in FFL, you may start thinking how you have caused undue influence on Vatican about this supposed scandalous partnership with a pharmacy company, please pray and submit to God a petition for you to be enlightened about your malicious charge, one that carries no foundation in truth and in spirituality!
Then I will follow what I recommend for today I will say a prayer for us all.
I will also have A special prayer for the CFC IC likewise for them to be discerning in their pronouncements about GK.
God Bless
CFC & GK member/advocate
Dear Brothers and Sister of CFC Qatar,
I send to all of you warm greetings and felicitations!
I write as your Parish Priest and Spiritual Director with much concern about this letter of Cardinal Rylko and the propaganda it has caused. Reading the letter gave me the impression that the Vatican is very much concerned with your community just like a mother to her children which is contrary to some interpretations coming from the other sides. There is no room for doubt that Cardinal Rylko and the Church is looking after the growth of CFC.
Br. Joe Tale should be commended for admitting the past mistakes. I do not know him personally but I should express my admiration for a man who can do this. A good leader doesn't ran away from his responsibility and point an accusing finger to anybody and everybody. You have with you an admirable leader.
I pity those who use Rylko's letter as a propaganda to discredit CFC. If they think you will simply let go and leave CFC, please tell them what your heart says. Tell them you will not run away and abandon your community. Tell them you have the courage to face all the criticisms they accuse you of. Tell them you will not leave just because you had disagreements with one another. Tell them you have found a family in CFC. Tell them you want to obey and listen to the Church authorities. Tell them you are willing to change for the better. Tell them to leave you alone and instead do what they think they want to do. If they do not leave you alone, beg them or even kneel down before them so they may realize how much you love CFC.
Courage dear brothers and sisters! Today is the time to stand up and admit the mistakes of the past. Today is also the time to move forward and face the future with hope.
Sincerely,
TV
Tomasito Veneracion OFM Cap.
Catholic Church of Our Lady of the Rosary
PO Box 12230
Doha- Qatar
Theres The Rub
Sayings
By Conrado de Quiros
Philippine Daily Inquirer
First Posted 00:17:00 04/22/2008
The way they're going, I wouldn't be surprised if more Filipinos turned Buddhist or Islamic or downright atheist. The Catholic Church is giving them every reason to. Except for luminous exceptions like Pope John Paul II and, nearer home, Archbishop Angel Lagdameo and the Association of Major Religious Superiors, the Catholic Church seems determined to preach only the new theology that God wants to reward the wicked and punish the good.
The Church's latest disincentive to faith is the letter of the Vatican's Pontifical Council for the Laity to Couples for Christ seeking to "correct" what is wrong with it. What's wrong with it presumably is that it is devoting its energies to Gawad Kalinga (GK), Tony Meloto's brainchild. Still more specifically, what's wrong with it is that GK is overemphasizing social work and accepting donations from pharmaceutical companies manufacturing contraceptives.
I know Meloto, we were both scholars at the Ateneo de Manila University and worked as porters at night to pay for our room and board at the dorm. I'm convinced that if the ranks of Catholics in this country have not gotten paper-thin, it's because of people like him. He is living proof that God works in mysterious ways and prefers his tribe rather than those who claim to be "close kami ni God" [�God and I are close�] who are Vatican's lieutenants and many of this country's bishops, to convey his truth to the world. I haven't met a more resolutely Christian person. Hell, I haven't met a more resolutely sincere person.
What on earth, or heaven, is wrong with accepting donations from companies that produce contraceptives? I leave the question of abortion to the usual suspects, but contraceptives? It's not as if they are weapons of mass destruction or toxic elements that cause cancer, like cigarettes. Condoms merely prevent human substance from exploding in the wrong places. Bombs induce inhuman substance to explode in the very wrong places, like public markets and hospitals. Particularly these days when the specter of famine sweeps not just across a few lands but across the world, courtesy of a runaway population outstripping food production, you've got to wonder if the Rock, which was what Christ called the Church, hasn't become a pebble.
Why shouldn't Meloto accept money from those companies to feed and house the poor? Tony himself cries out eloquently, and not without a trace of sarcasm: "Should all Catholics who work with pharmaceuticals resign? Why is it OK for many Catholic organizations to receive money from them and not OK for GK to care for the poor...? If loving this country, serving the children, is anti-life, then I need to be enlightened again as a Catholic because I only desire to be faithful."
What I myself find galling is that the Vatican should worry about GK accepting money from companies that manufacture contraceptives and be smug about its clergy in the form of the Filipino bishops accepting money from a patently poisonous source. That poisonous source, or cholera-producing well, being Malaca�ang and its milking cows, the Philippine Amusement and Gaming Corp. and the Philippine Charity Sweepstakes Office. The latter two directly engage in gambling, an activity that, completely unlike safe sex, has been known to spread disease, if of the mind. Meloto merely accepts money from pharmaceuticals that promote contraception, the bishops accept money from someone who promotes the abortion of democracy. Meloto merely accepts money from pharmaceuticals to do nothing more than feed and house the poor. The bishops accept money from a hypocritical to do everything in their power to keep her in power just so they could fatten and gladden themselves.
But the more mind-boggling thing is the charge that GK is overemphasizing social work. You would laugh, except that it hurts. Again Meloto cries out: "My pain as Catholic and as Filipino is seeing our people suffer from poverty and our country labeled as corrupt. We have not done enough for our poor countrymen. Poverty in the only Catholic country in Asia is a failure in discipleship and Christian stewardship. My dream is for the world to see that it is possible for a Catholic country to rise from poverty because we practice what we preach." That makes him more Christian than Gaudencio Cardinal Rosales. Hell, that makes him more Christian than the Pope.
How in God's name is it possible for anyone to do too much social work in this country? That is like accusing a doctor of prescribing too much medicine to someone fighting for his life. At the very least that a lay organization like Couples should somehow betray the Christian spirit by moving heaven and earth to feed the hungry and house the homeless is batty. What, they get to be more Christian by spending their time attending Mass and avoiding de-coupling while living sad, sad lives?
At the very most, that even a religious organization itself, which the clergy represents, should somehow betray its Christian teachings by plucking the hungry from the claws of hunger and the homeless from the lash of wind and rain is battier. Didn't Christ say what you do for the least of your brethren you do for him? Didn't Christ say not everyone who says, "Lord! Lord!" will enter the kingdom of God? And didn't Christ spend his time on the road with fishers and a well-known prostitute rather than in the temple with the Pharisees who were better-known prostitutes? I do not claim to know the ways of heaven, but when St. Peter goes out one day to meet Meloto who has praised his God silently by doing the most for the least of his brethren, and the bishops who have praised their God loudly by refusing to condemn the most corrupt of their "sisthren," I have a good idea whom he will send upstairs and downstairs.
Christ did say one other thing. It wasn't that the sick shall inherit the earth, it was that the meek would.
I am girding my loins for the battle ahead.
What CFC stands for today, is what I stand for today. I am locking my arms with the rest who'll stay. For the leaders of our Church let's all pray.
The Round-Eyed Toddler
“THE MYSTICAL BODY’ STIRS ...
“ATLAS SHRUGGED”
THIS IS ADMITTEDLY BEING METICULOUS (FOR THE SAKE OF CLARITY )
1. The Philippine episcopate (represented by the Chairman of the CPCP-ECLA) lacked fidelity to objective truths about the “scandals” it has alluded to CFC for “overemphasizing” social work in GK, particularly the latter’s acceptance of donations from companies promoting contraceptives. As a result, the Filipino Catholic must engage in a classic battle on Faith, Reason, and Morals, which may rock the age-old principle of fidelity to the Magisterim of the Catholic Church, an unsettling situation that has stirred the Mystical Body of Christ in the only Catholic country in Asia....
2. “Self- preservationists” and self-centered CFC leaders, including a self-proclaimed “keeper of CFC charism” have denounced GK for the same “overemphasis on social work”, blended their bankrupt moral conclusions with the grudging approval of some clerical authorities, and by their convoluted reasoning, have argued that CFC should abort GK, and as it COULD NOT, CFC should break up to make way for a separatist “restoration” group, the FFL. By this group’s rejection of GK, “ATLAS SHRUGGED” as it were (acknowledgment of Ayn Rand is in order here) and the “global” nature of CFC has been endangered. Meantime, instead of censuring the local clergy for assenting to the break-up of CFC without its prior consent, as was expected under the statutes applicable, the Vatican ordered a public “act of contrition” by CFC for overemphasizing social work in GK, more particularly of CFC’s acceptance of donations from companies promoting contraceptives.
Brothers and Sisters, the battles have joined again...but the perimeter lines have been expanded to the morality of our Mother Church’s social action.
WillyJ, hi there! About loving and the truth I agree with you that it must not “preclude correcting while standing up uncompromisingly for the objective truth...” Therefore, may we all welcome righteous correction of our positions and assumptions on this unfortunate battle, and at the same time not “passively tolerate error” so that we can evangelize our Faith and uphold the truth...
Thank you father for your prayers and support...
Long i have heard many bishops' words being used for propaganda to discredit this community, but hearing your sharing and encouraging words gave me hope that there are people in the church that willing to offer their support and prayer.
Pray for us Father TV and thank you again for your encouraging words.
Sleepless in NJ
Here's another article from ABS-CBN. I don't condone some of the speculations but it's an interesting insight by another observer:
-----------------------------
Hate campaign against Gawad Kalinga will not succeed
By Jose Montelibano
I am not an official spokesman of CFC or GK, but I am an involved member and a GK advocate. Allow me to share my knowledge and perspective.
In the center of controversy are 1) fundamentalism that is triggered by sudden growth and, 2) hypocrisy which is a constant presence in the halls of hierarchy and bureaucracy.
Real story
The real story is somewhat hidden from the article. (Ed. See Related Article) It is about the breakaway of a small splinter group from mainstream CFC - and it was led by the leader of CFC for almost 26 years. Seen by many CFC leaders as a reaction to the sudden success of GK in both numbers and popularity which in turn propelled another CFC leader into the limelight of both CFC and non-CFC audiences, the traditional conjugal leadership of CFC began to make moves that made it difficult for GK to grow. Imposing policies that would limit the participation of CFC members into a work that was sweeping the nation, the traditional conjugal leadership of CFC at the same time mandated other work like "pro-life and special ministries" where they actively encouraged members to join.
The P50M DOH contract
Taking on the pro-life work seemed like a move towards religious adherence because the Church is quite active in it. But many saw the pro-life work also as a way to get access to government funds - specifically, the P50 million contract from DOH to promote natural family planning. While the contract was on-going, the funds gave the traditional conjugal leadership the capacity to spend without fiscal prudence and making their favored few enjoy perks usually not available to workers of Christian renewal communities like CFC. What is noteworthy is the absence of the same pro-life work before the contract and its disappearance after the contract was terminated ahead of schedule upon the insistence of other members of the CFC Council. Today, many await the detailed post-audit of the way the funds of the contract were spent because it is suspected that there had been grave abuse and misuse of government funds towards personal interests at the expense of the effective promotion of a natural family planning program.
CFC’s former ‘conjugal leadership’
The history of CFC includes the formal leadership through a 7-man Council which, in fact, was one man who could overrule the others - if they at all attempted to get in his way. Behind the formal leadership of one was the informal leadership of the spouse. It is not a strange situation in renewal communities and many painful transitions have occurred in communities when traditional leaderships begin to experience growing resistance to the absolute rule of one from the other members. Breaking away after being spurned by a community they had long ruled absolutely is part of a pattern, not an exception. History is full of failed leaders, and they are so many that we do not know of them anymore. History is kind only to the victors, or remembers the ones who went berserk and inflicted massive damage to others.
Poaching by CFC breakaway group
Because the breakaway of the splinter group is relatively new, actually less than one year, there is a lot of aggressive poaching on the ground so that their small numbers will grow the fastest way. Usually, renewal communities grow as a result of evangelistic work, where people renewed by the influence of the community would often ask to join, or be invited to join. But that takes a lot of work, and a lot of time. CFC had peaked to a reported 1.4 million circa 1996-1997, but I discovered when I had joined that there was a steady decline in membership from the late 90's till the breakaway last year. To my friends, I had shared my personal view that the declining numbers signified a waning spirit and commitment to the community because of a leadership that did not know how to take the community to the next level. Again, this is not a strange occurrence but a pattern for most organizations like CFC. The history of charismatic/renewal communities in the Philippines will bear me out - beginning with the Cursillo to all who have followed. Any charismatic/renewal group that went "massive" in membership ultimately diminished, and sometimes by infighting and breakaways.
The aggressive poaching does not limit itself to just trying to win old friends and asking them to join the breakaway group. It can also involve trying to put down CFC and especially GK which is now the fresh spirit that perks up the community and much of the Philippines. Many moves have been engineered to "contain" GK, or to remove it from CFC formally. These moves were not spiritual in context - they were political. It was a matter of control. So what else is new?
But with the traditional conjugal leadership rejected by the same community that had for a long time looked at them with great reverence and submission, what else could they have done to recover what they lost? What else could they have done to hide their abject failure? And how do they get back at forces they believe caused their downfall? For others like them in history, what had they done?
The familiar pattern has found an interesting nuance, however, because a failed leader who used to be unafraid to lead the community to new territories with new ways turns around, 180 degrees, and goes against his very words, or what he had written about in books which were treated like the Bible by CFC members. One of the most distinct features of CFC was its independence from the parishes; in fact, it was proud to describe itself as "trans-parochial" and I believe the Vatican officially gave this recognition and its blessing. But this "trans-parochial" status irked many bishops and parish priests who were long used to controlling religious lay communities. However, the leadership of CFC was able to withstand the reluctance or outright objection of many parish priests and bishops and still managed to grow CFC in many of these unfriendly areas. In one book entitled "Friend Or Foe," the oftentimes uneasy relationship between CFC and the bishops is clearly seen, and the actuation of the CFC leader quite obvious.
Role of Bishop Gabriel Reyes
When they had lost control, however, the traditional conjugal leadership sought the active help of key bishops including Bishop Gabriel Reyes, the head of LAIKO in the Philippines. Of course, one does not complain and make it appear that one is jealous, that one is vengeful, and that one wants control. With that as one's motivations, even if it were true, which I believe to be so, the public stance must be something that the Church can openly support. Anything and everything that could be thrown at GK in order to weaken the present CFC leadership and erode the public trust and support of GK has been dished out. The present issue is one of these that had been offered as "proof" that Tony Meloto has "veered away" from spiritual to social work, and the partnerships with pharmaceutical companies who may have anti-life products as defined by the Church as further proof to the same. It did not matter that the complainant stood as witness to the very partnership used later as evidence of wanton disregard for Church values. After all, one only says "I am sorry" and he can be forgiven, according to Church practice.
GK's work with pharmaceutical companies
The insistence of Cardinal Rylko of the Vatican for CFC to terminate the partnership of GK with a supportive pharmaceutical company and to publicly apologize for the "scandal" it caused is supposed to be a trade-off for the Vatican's formal instructions to the breakaway group to stop using the CFC name as the Vatican recognizes only the authentic CFC which is identified with the GK work. Perhaps, in their fear of losing a recognition that is valuable to a Catholic community, the present leaders of CFC gave in, caved in, or whatever they will call it in the privacy of their consciences.
The letters that were written about this transaction, because it could not be anything but a transaction, were then leaked to the media. By whom is open to speculation, but maybe the party benefited is more suspect than the party aggrieved. Well, anything is fair in love and war, and it is Christian on our side to simply shrug off the malice and spite of people who anyway have no longevity and legacy to sustain their lifetime's work. This is called Christian forgiveness, or more popularly known as "consuelo de bobo."
Now, what? In the latest article in the front page today of the Inquirer, Bishop Gabriel Reyes is trying to temper what has been sensationalized, perhaps because he himself was party to it and wants like Pontius Pilate to appear uninvolved. Of course, the Church should temper it. The spirituality and love for fellow man is oozing in Gawad Kalinga The hundreds of thousands who have been personally involved in building up the work to what it is now and to what it will be tomorrow will resent the implication that their motive is less than admirable, or less spiritual when it faithfully complies with the primordial Christian obligation to feed the hungry, to heal the sick, to shelter and clothe the naked, to free the oppressed.
Pope Benedict doing it the GK way
What we speak of here in the current brouhaha with the actions of the concerned Church personalities is a matter of Church protocol or even hypocrisy, not Church dogma. As Cardinal Rylko and Bishop Gabriel Reyes smear, deliberately or consequently, the most noble work that has emerged from Christian hearts on a collective mode, Pope Benedict XVI eagerly prepared for his visit to the United States, the most anti-life nation in the world by Church definition of anti-life, host to legal abortion, massive divorce, manufacturer and promoter of anti-life products and services, as defined by the Church, same sex unions, and others that I miss because I have not been a rabid follower of the anti-life list of definitions of the Catholic Church. Pope Benedict XVI also happily accepted the formal welcome of President George W. Bush, the most anti-life president of the world, not only because he is president of an anti-life nation as defined by the Church, but because he personally pushed for the invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan which the Church condemns and defines as anti-life.
Pope Benedict XVI is doing it the Gawad Kalinga way, engaging rather than condemning, evangelizing by witnessing rather than spreading hate by being judgmental and fundamentalist. Pope Benedict XVI said that his visit will result in much good, and Gawad Kalinga shares that conviction with its own work.
Just as Pope Benedict XVI justifies his visit to the US, for the objectives of the Church, GK justifies its partnerships, for the objectives of nation building by returning human dignity to the poor, the weak, the neglected who have lived sub-human lives as a matter of social inheritance. The Church calls that social justice. Cardinal Rylko and Bishop Reyes call it an "overemphasis" on the social instead of the spiritual. That is not only a spiritual distortion, it is contrary to Church teachings. But in the case of Cardinal Rylko, I will call it only ignorance of the truth, or the human weakness of believing a source without sound basis. Cardinal Rylko can come to the Philippines and see the love and sacrifice of tens of thousands of Christians and be amazed that he has insulted the nobility of Filipinos who have done more than most of Christendom in collectively manifesting the virtues of their faith. He can then say, "Shame on those who misled me!""
I truly appreciate the courage of Pope Benedict XVI. He went to the lions' den because he wanted to validate a fundamental fact - that Christ was here to save and not to condemn, and that those who are to be saved are the lost, not the found. Being head of the Catholic Church is an august position and responsibility. He is trying his best to share the love and the good news even as underlings sometimes do their best to be High Priests and Pharisees out to kill the Jesus who exposes them for their hypocrisy. Thank goodness for Pope Benedict XVI, and thank goodness for the late Pope John Paul II. To these two, evangelization is witnessing the love of Christ to all, not to convert or control them, but to liberate them from poverty, from corruption, from oppression, from fundamentalism and hypocrisy, from the clutches of the evil that lurks of those who claim to be spiritual and moral leaders.
Gawad Kalinga will move on, stronger because the hate campaign against it by those who share no love for the poor as their primordial obligation cannot succeed, not in the Philippines where the poor are the majority and are seen as the weak stones of a weak nation. Gawad Kalinga will move on to build a strong nation because its love for the poor, the weak, the sick, and the oppressed will transform the rejected stones to become the cornerstones of a new Philippines that we and our children can be proud of. The social work is an inner work, the formation of character grounded on faith and patriotism. What better spiritual work is there in the Philippines?
From the letter of Vatican Stanislaw Cardinal Rylco, he said that:
1. “In describing the facts, you admitted that in this difficult period lived by the association Couples for Christ, there have been mistakes… It was also important that you have realized that much scandal to correct this.”
Question to Bro. Joe Tale or IC: What are these mistakes? Please let everybody know so they are not defending admitted-mistakes.
2. He also said, “In addition, since this has caused public scandal, a certain public reparation is also needed. We urge you that you prepare and spread in the newspaper in the Philippines and on your web-side a well thought and clear public declaration recognizing the erroneous steps taken. It is recommendable that you prepare it with the help of some Bishops and your ecclesiastical Advisor so as to benefit the healing and growth of your association.”
Question to Bro. Joe Tale or IC: You said that you will follow the Vatican… so when you wrote the ad in Philippine Star, did you do this with the help of some Bishops and CFC Advisor?
Salamat po.
Dear Brothers & Sisters and those who said we are over-emphasizing our social work! YES WE ARE! DAHIL KULANG PA NGA ITO! UNTIL SUCH TIME NA WALA NA TAYONG MAKITANG PULUBI SA KALYE HINDI TAYO TITIGIL KAHIT SINO PANG VATIKAN ANG HAHARANG DYAN! That is why kami dito sa U.S. binabandilyo namin ang mga magandang nangyari dyan sa atin..kahit sisiraan pa ng mga kong sino man ang GK..tuloy pa rin kami dito para kahit kunti at malayo man, makatulong din.
Please read this message from one of our brothers here;
ANCOP Foundation USASave The Dates
Greetings Everyone,
Just wanted to share with you an upcoming GK event in the Philipppines that we can all be a part of and witness just as if we were there.
This week April 21-26, 2008, commences the 3rd annual GK1MB Bayani Challenge dubbed H.O.P.E. 2008: Building the highway of peace - an event where nation building is an adventure pushed to the extreme (Gawad Kalinga website). This year's Bayani Challenge events are being held in Bukidnon and Lanao del Sur simultaneously.
On April 24 (Thurs) 5PM Pacific (April 25 9AM till 10PM Manila date/time), you'll have the opportunity to view via webcast (IPTV/TVU), on your PC, the GK1MB events as they transpire in Malaybalay, Bukidnon, Southern Philippines. Don't worry, even if you are not a "tekkie", the set up is straight-forward.
Here are the details that I received:
System:
- PC only (Pentium+ or equivlent), sorry not MAC I'm told.
- will run on IE 6 and up only, no other browsers.
- Cable or DSL connection (dial-up, not defined).
- Click on this link TVUnetworks or copy and paste http://pages.tvunetworks.com/channels/# on your IE browser.
- On the channels listing, look for and click on channel 61713 (GK channel).
- For better viewing, download a TVUPlayer.
The link should take you to the download site, click on the "I Agree" button.
Save the file (TVUPlayer.zip) to your desktop.
Open the file.
Click setup and run, then finish.
Once finished you should see a TVUPlayer icon on your desktop.
Run TVUPlayer and select channel 61713.
- For non-IE users, you'll need to download the TVU player.
Once you've selected channel 61713, you'll know its working when you see a marathon of GK videos and Jesuit music videos running. If you're not caught up with your GK videos, now is a good time. The videos will be running continuously until close to the start time, then will go LIVE.
For the "non-tekkies", happy viewing!!! For the "tekkies", I'm sure there's always more than one way to do something. But I'm sure there's only ONE GK WAY!!!
Lastly, if you haven't registered yet or are still undecided whether you should go to the GK Summit, please come, join us, inspire us, be inspired, be informed, stay up-to-date, witness and be bearers of the good news of GK. YES there is hope. One vision. One global army against poverty! See you in San Diego.
GKOM News USA
T2s, titas, let us never forget nman that the ROman Catholci Apostolic Church is still the true Church of Jesus Christ, and we must follow her teachings eagerly.
Regarding the mistakes admitted by T2 Joe, GK indeed has some "mistakes" pero naka quarantine lng po ung mga mistakes, ndi na po pinalaki. There is no such thing as a PERFECT ORGANIZATION. In terms of the accepting money, if the Church sees it as wrong, then we must submit to the Church.
Remember the talks po t2s and titas, we are dispensible ANYTIME. CFC IS DISPENSIBLE anytime, because God's work would continue with or without us.
As a former GK Rep. I didn't see the overemphasis in our work. Although there are "SOME" Church Leaders, like some bishops na medyo pasaway, its true. And its a part of the life of Christ's Church. Let's just cope up with it.
Let us NOT worry, di ba, if God intends that CFC would still continue, and be more effective as a SERVANT OF THE CHURCH, he would guide us and protect us for the next 23 years.
Our work is great, our work is lying ahead of us!
Stop Serving....Start Loving :)
"Its not as literal as it seems, reflect on it" :)
* From the Phil. Daily Inquirer article Vatican ‘corrects’ Couples for Christ’s ‘GK’ focus:
"Asked whether the CFC would move to impose limitations on the donations to be received by Gawad Kalinga, Tale merely said the matter was part of the discussion among CFC officials."
* When Joe Tale was asked a number of times in the radio interview 'kung tatanggap pa ba ng donasyon galing sa mga drug firm na gumagawa ng contraceptives", he said "Oo, masakit pero oo".
Ang tinggin ko dito ay CFC/GK can clearly afford not to accept donations from these drug firms, what is making them hard to do it is... this will make IC WRONG and FRANK CORRECT. That's what IC doesn't want to do. So you will see these 'asking for clarrification' kuno, 'under discussion' kuno, unclear public apology (batu-bato sa langit) and all these critical articles from CFC members.
IF CFC really wants to follow the Vatican's 'correction' then FOLLOW! Masakit, pero kung dapat then... FOLLOW! Don't blame the bishop or the cardinal or FFL. And IF CFC DOES NOT WANT to follow it, then LET IT BE KNOWN. Hindi iyong, yes but members are saying differently and blaming everybody else.
My dear brothers and sisters,
I think it's now very clear that the Vatican does not want GK to accept questionable donations, and I fully agree since these things are matters of faith (totally different from the "strong recommendation" which was an administrative matter). If you've heard from brother Joe Tale, he said that such partnerships are now non-existent (assuming they were there to begin with). (He said "masakit" and I understand him because those drug companies can donate live-giving medicines for the sick, and now we are losing those too.)
Our next step should be to get the specifics or the details on what is allowed and what's not so we can prevent similar problems in the future (see some clarifications I've raised here). Even if we've heard from Cardinal Sin or Mother Theresa that accepting from questionable sources is morally permissible, it doesn't make it right. It only explains that we too can commit the same mis-conceptions they had. At this point, the direction from Cardinal Rylko is clear in these matters.
And even though I've already heard Joe Tale acknowledged some of the problems before, I am so glad that CFC made an official apology about it. I am so honored and assured to be under the leadership of an International Council that acknowledges the problems and committed to solve them.
We are to remember that we are Catholics first and CFC second. The Church has withstood problems for 2000 years and it will continue to exist, with or without CFC.
We also have to remember that Bishop Reyes is one with us in making sure that we follow the policies of the Church. It's unfortunate that some of what he said in his letter are unfounded but we should not crucify him. Instead, we should win back his heart by informing him of the truth. And most importantly, we should pray for his heart. We also need to be thankful to Cardinal Rylko for being straightforward in this matter. Even though this blog is not representative of the whole CFC, our criticism of some of the clergy might be misconstrued as an attack to the Church, specially by those forces bent on destroying us. Remember that there are a lot of clergy who have supported us and prayed for us during this crisis. Our Church which includes the clergy and us is not perfect and it is constantly in the process of purification. At this point where the Church seems to be taking heat for the perceived "hate campaign" against GK as reflected in the media, the Church needs our support. We are Catholics and we are all in this together. We are CFC and we are one with the Church. We claim the Lord's promise that all things work for the good of those who love Him.
God bless us all!
To the anonymous who said:
When Joe Tale was asked a number of times in the radio interview 'kung tatanggap pa ba ng donasyon galing sa mga drug firm na gumagawa ng contraceptives", he said "Oo, masakit pero oo".
I hope you only mis-heard. This is what Joe Tale's words were:
(commentator: asking about contraceptives and donation...)
I would like to say that the partnerships were entered into with a good faith, with a pure heart. Kasi yun namang tulong nila had nothing to do with contraceptives or what. I would like to assure the audience na wala pong GK sites na nag-di-distribute ng contraceptives. Yung pong tulong ng mga kumpanya ay doon sa ibang aspeto, capacitive building para dun mga beneficiaries to help them deal with health concerns. Pangalawa, gusto ko lang din linawin na in the process, this matter was brought into our attention and we did something about it. We did something about it. Naki-usap po kami dun sa mga tumutulong at napag-usapan na siguro mas maigi na hindi na natin i-tuloy... (commentator: hindi** nyo ho tumanggap pa kayo ng donasyon?).. Ang ano nga dun ay yung itigil po yung pakiki-pag-partner although masakit man yun sa amin dahil marami din pong naitulong etong mga companies na eto sa amin ngunit malinaw din na kami po ay isang Katolikong organisasyon at, at the end of the day, we follow. (commentator.. asking again about accepting donations from contraceptive producing companies..) Kami ay susunod sa guidelines ng simbahan. Kanya din nung nabanggit yung mga katanungan... Our identity as Catholic is clear, and we will abide by the guidelines of the Church. Pero dun po sa mga bagay-bagay na iyun, palagay ko meron pong space para mapag-usapan or mapaliwanag, ma-clarify ang ika nga mga gray areas. (commentator.. so gray area pa eto?) Sa ngayon po ay malinaw po yung direction ng Simbahan so kami po ay susunod. (Commentator again ask the same question the third time about accepting such donations...) Yun po ang guideline kaya kami po ay susunod... I see this with, ano po, with with sadness ngunit (also with faith) na sa atin pong pag-sunod ng ating Simbahan is something would trully really come out of it and will be a real blessing...
You are absolutely right that he was asked numerous times about accepting donations from these drug companies. Unfortunately, some of us only hear what we want to hear.
God bless!!!
i totally agree with bro Deo. the authority on the matter (vatican) of accepting donations from pharma companies have spoken. we need to abide, whether we like it or not, whether we understand it or not.
nagtanong tayo, "pwede po ba?" ang sabi ng vatican, "sorry, hindi pwede." kailangan nating tanggapin ito.
panawagan sa mga kapatid sa GK lalo na sa mga passionate GK leaders including bros Tony Meloto and Boy Montelibano, hinay hinay lang sa pagbatikos sa Simbahan. wag kalimutan na bahagi pa rin kayo ng CFC na bahagi ng Simbahan.
Define Direct and Indirect...
If GK indirect involvement with phizer is wrong... then are we going to condemn all who work in a hospital that does abortion, even though they don’t have direct involvement with the abortion.
Might as well condemn me for teaching in US, where students here are being taught sex education that doesn’t comply with church doctrines... even though I am not the one teaching health (I teach special education)
Now, ask the church (local up to the Vatican) if they never received money from organize crime.
Is it possible that the Cardinal can be misinformed or has only one perspective. Does the Cardinal know the political issues involved split.
At the end... who OK the split... Who arbitrated and said that split was the only solution... Some priest disagreed with Bp. Reyes call... some said He should continued pushing both parties to continue their dialogue (like any family, would a priest recommend divorce over reconciliation)... can someone Ask him this questions.
There is nothing wrong with questioning the Church, yes even the Vatican. We are not in the inquisition that if we do so we will be condemned as heretics.
Now, if Joe Tale and council made the decision to follow the church's direction... I commend them for it...
But we should not stop asking these questions to the church (Bishop Reyes and Cardinals) Tony Meloto’s questions are valid… who does the church serve (of course the answer is Christ, but in the work here as pastors) ... the church ... who is the church.... we are the church.
Good day everyone,
For the anonymous who said this:
IF CFC really wants to follow the Vatican's 'correction' then FOLLOW! Masakit, pero kung dapat then... FOLLOW! Don't blame the bishop or the cardinal or FFL. And IF CFC DOES NOT WANT to follow it, then LET IT BE KNOWN. Hindi iyong, yes but members are saying differently and blaming everybody else.
Reaction/Question/Comment:
1. We follow...that's Clear! JT already made it clear in the radio interview...so no objection about following the guidelines set.
2. We do not blame the bishop or the cardinal, but I personally blame FFL (labas ang CFC dito ha!)Kung hindi ba naman kayo nagrebelde at nagtampurorot, eh di sana maayos tayu ngayun! Kung nagtiwala kayo sa council to solve the matter acording to their wisdom eh di sana walang gulo.
3. Is the direction of the Church not to accept funds from company's who manufacture contraceptive's is dogmatic or not? Can anyone tell me on this? Kapag ba tumanggap ka ng tulong mula sa mga kompanya na ito, hindi ka na makaka-akyat sa langit..hindi ka na ba maliligtas?
3.1) I believe, like Mother Theresa and Cardinal Sin's acceptance of such donation is morally permissible...why?
3.1.1) The law is made for the good of man, and not man made for the good of the law. Sinabi rin ni Frank yan...dba?
3.1.2) Remember the story of David, who ate the offering in the altar? It is forbidden po according to the law...but was morally permissible.
3.1.3) Remember the levites who turn his back on the victim but a samaritan helped? By law, the levites did what he is legally bound to do, but the samaritan did according to his conscience.
3.1.4) Remember the teachings of the pharisees about being exempted in helping their parents when they dedicate themselves to the works of the church. Legally correct, but morally incorrect.
3.1.5) Kapatid, i hope Cardinal Rylko and Bishop Reyes should give a fair view on those company's who want to help in the work with the poor without being bias and judgemental.
3.1.6) Look, hindi ba pagiging anti-life din ang hayaan na lng na mamatay sa gutom ang mahihirap, ang hayaang mamatay sa simpleng sakit coz they could not avail a better medical services, could not live a life with dignity becuase of illiteracy?
3.1.7) Pro-life is not only protecting/respecting the rights of the unborn to live, but also to give dignity and value to the lives of millions of people who live in subhuman condition.
3.1.8) A genuine Christian is not judgemental to people.
3. Unlike CBCP who asks fund from PAGCOR, GK did not ask from Pfizer or Wyeth. Sila ang lumapit at nag-abot ng tulong.
4. Okey, GK will not receive money from Pfizer and Wyeth or any phramaceutical companies whom you believe manufactures contaceptives. What if, yung buong labor force ng kompanya na yun wants to help thru volunteer labor? What if they will say, "we want to build a community hall for GK", "we want to conduct feeding to GK", "we want to donate medicines for the poor", "we want to build 100 houses for GK" (but they will handle their funds and not to give it to GK) do you think is it permissible now? Pharmaceutical companys will not give funds to GK anymore..but can they still help? If the issue here is acceptance of funds.. then GK will not accept it anymore. But if they want to help in terms of labor, expertise, services, materials..can we still stop them?
5. I think it would be a total HYPOCRISY if we prevent someone, (may it to be a person or an entity) to help just because of his nature of work, i tell you it is a big HYPOCRISY. And who will suffer?... the millions of poor people!
6. The partnership of GK and this corporation has something got to do with uplifting the subhuman conditions of the poor into a decent and dignified living..it is about nation building. And it is NOT partnering about killing the unborn by producing contraceptives.
7. It is unfair that the critics of GK (like FFL) will say that the faithful is confused when we accept donations from the corporation who manufacture contraceptive, because we are a pro-life organization.
8. What do you mean FFL..that when GK accepts help from Anti-life companies, does it mean GK is anti-life too? If that is what you conclude, napakababaw naman. You ask Bishop Gabby about that..and also Cardinal Rylko. I think the vatican must review the guidelines they have set and put it in a right context of the gospel.
At bakit kung tinulungan ka ba ang aso...aso ka na rin? Kung kumakain ka ng karne galing sa baboy..baboy ka na rin? Kababawan yang guidelines na yan! tell the vatican..to review it! The purpose of the guidelines should help the people to gain a dignified living and not to close our eyes, our ears in the reality of the cruelty brought by poverty!
God bless po sa lahat!
Bro Mero po ulit ito! :-)
Hello po to Kapatid na Deo Volante:
reaction lng po sa sinabi niyong:
"We are to remember that we are Catholics first and CFC second. The Church has withstood problems for 2000 years and it will continue to exist, with or without CFC."
Reaction/Comment:
Kapatid, as for me...first and foremost po kristiyano ako bago katoliko at CFC.
We become catholics by the rituals and the ceremonies and the laws that we abide, but remember we become Christians by the kind of life that we live.
Maraming Katoliko hindi kristiyano pero ang totong Kristiyano nasisigurado kong isa siyang Katoliko!
maraming Salamat po Bro. Deo
Si Bro. Mero po ulit ito. :-)
comment ko lang to anonymous who said-
"When Joe Tale was asked a number of times in the radio interview 'kung tatanggap pa ba ng donasyon galing sa mga drug firm na gumagawa ng contraceptives", he said "Oo, masakit pero oo".
correction: please listen again, he did not say that
"Ang tinggin ko dito ay CFC/GK can clearly afford not to accept donations from these drug firms, what is making them hard to do it is..."
correction:
you are obviously not a cfc member that is why you think that way, impersonal. for you it is easy that, easy to accept kasi wala ka sa kalagayan namin
for us cfc this is very personal because the subject is about the way we live. thank you for your comments bro but please bear in mind that from here on you should be prudent in your words kasi nakakasakit ka ng loob. if you mean well, please paraphrase what you are saying. and we will gladly listen to your comment
"this will make IC WRONG and FRANK CORRECT. That's what IC doesn't want to do."
comment:
The IC does not work that way, nor think that way. It has never set out to do things or say things just so that they can prove that Frank is wrong. Otherwise matagal na nila pinalabas ang 5 affidavits where the people in the center had valid complaints!!!!!!!!!
"So you will see these 'asking for clarrification' kuno, 'under discussion' kuno, unclear public apology (batu-bato sa langit) and all these critical articles from CFC members.
"IF CFC really wants to follow the Vatican's 'correction' then FOLLOW! Masakit, pero kung dapat then... FOLLOW!"
correction:
yes, that is what IC is saying and doing- follow indeed
that is also what they are asking the members to do follww
"Don't blame the bishop or the cardinal or FFL. And IF CFC DOES NOT WANT to follow it, then LET IT BE KNOWN. Hindi iyong, yes but members are saying differently and blaming everybody else."
half korek ka kapatid kaya may correction pa rin:
CFC is one with the church
members po ang nagsasalita, but remember we are 800k strong cfc with 800k different minds and 800k different opinions sali mo dyan mga asawa at mga anak!
patience patience all these will come to pass, everyone will be enlightened, sana kayo rin!
kanta na lang tayo:
I will follow Him, follow Him wherever He may go...
Follow-follow-follow
amen
i understand that vatican principle of not partnering because it must have been a carefully studied policy, but to ask CFC to apologize in public i think that is frank principle.
you know as in frank, yes frank, who else but frank. thats frankly speaking, the thread that binds us down.
now i know what persecution means! what a privelege to share this experience, it is a grace. let us embrace this cross, it is God given so we will follow...
Can one "overemphasize" social work?
Depends on how "social work" is defined in the context. If it is a Godless type of social work then in that case it is not compatible the Social Doctrine of the Church. On the other hand, if it is integrated with what Pope John Paul II says about "new forms of evangelization", then such social work is unified and integral with the mission of the Church, and can never be overemphasized.
GK and similar missions of the faithful for the poor must be understood and directed in the context of Social Doctrine of the Church. Thus the Compendium of the Social Doctrine of the Church states:
66. The Church's social doctrine is an integral part of her evangelizing ministry. Nothing that concerns the community of men and women — situations and problems regarding justice, freedom, development, relations between peoples, peace — is foreign to evangelization, and evangelization would be incomplete if it did not take into account the mutual demands continually made by the Gospel and by the concrete, personal and social life of man. Profound links exist between evangelization and human promotion...
67. The Church's social doctrine "is itself a valid instrument of evangelization" and is born of the always new meeting of the Gospel message and social life. Understood in this way, this social doctrine is a distinctive way for the Church to carry out her ministry of the Word and her prophetic role. “In effect, to teach and to spread her social doctrine pertains to the Church's evangelizing mission and is an essential part of the Christian message, since this doctrine points out the direct consequences of that message in the life of society and situates daily work and struggles for justice in the context of bearing witness to Christ the Saviour”. This is not a marginal interest or activity, or one that is tacked on to the Church's mission, rather it is at the very heart of the Church's ministry of service…
83. The first recipient of the Church's social doctrine is the Church community in its entire membership, because everyone has social responsibilities that must be fulfilled. The conscience is called by this social teaching to recognize and fulfil the obligations of justice and charity in society. This doctrine is a light of moral truth that inspires appropriate responses according to the vocation and ministry of each Christian. In the tasks of evangelization, that is to say, of teaching, catechesis and formation that the Church's social doctrine inspires, it is addressed to every Christian, each according to the competence, charisms, office and mission of proclamation that is proper to each one.
182. The principle of the universal destination of goods requires that the poor, the marginalized and in all cases those whose living conditions interfere with their proper growth should be the focus of particular concern. To this end, the preferential option for the poor should be reaffirmed in all its force…
It is our firm hope that GK’s mission to the poor proves integral to our expression of Faith, and we should indeed remain open to righteous correction if we ever do lose sight: To love one another with the Love that inspires Jesus’ ministry among men, who Himself said “I have come to bring glad tidings to the poor, proclaim release to the captives, to set at liberty those who are oppressed,... to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord.”
Might it be possible to overemphasize this?
on hearing all these things...
Question1: with or without the pharma companies in question... will CFC's work continue?
Reply: CFC's work will continue!
Question2: with or without FFL bugging CFC... will CFC's work breakdown?
Reply: CFC's work will not stop!
To Brother Tony Meloto, Boy Montelibano and other GK advocates/supporters
Relax lang mga kapatid sa pag papatama at pagbatikos sa Simbahan. Karamihan ng mga kapatid sa pananampalataya dito sa CFC ay laking-simbahan.
Tulad ng nabanggit ng ibang nagsipagsulat dito, ang CFC ay DAPAT sumunod sa alituntunin ng nakatataas na simbahan. Napakabata pa ng CFC para hindi sumunod sa matanda ng Vatican.
Inamin na ng kapatid na Joe Tale na may kamaliang nangyari, humingi ng patawad ang ating lider at sana gayun din po tayo. Huwag na po tayong magmatigas bagkus magpakumbaba.
Marami na sa mga kapatiran ang ganyan ang ginawa subalit marami rin (tulad ng mga naririto sa blog na ito) na ang takbo ng pag-iisip ay kabaligtaran. Nirerespeto ko rin po kayo at isasama ko sa aking pagdarasal na sana, makita nating ang CFC at pati na rin ang GK ay isang daan lamang tungo sa mas malaking pakikipagkapatiran ng buong mundo.
Kapayapaan lang po!
Comment po para kay bro Mero.
"We become catholics by the rituals and the ceremonies and the laws that we abide, but remember we become Christians by the kind of life that we live."
I understand what you mean that you want to distinguish people "following the ritual" to people "applying the teachings of christ in their lives". However, using the term "catholic" to mean only following rituals and laws is incomplete. The Catholic Church teaches us to follow rituals AND to apply the teachings of christ in our lives. Mali nga e, dapat ang sentence ko "the catholic church teaches us to apply the teachings of christ in our lives" lang kasi kasama sa "teachings of christ" ang rituals!
"Kapatid, as for me...first and foremost po kristiyano ako bago katoliko at CFC."
I understand that you want to emphasize living out the teachings of christ rather than being a member of the catholic church and CFC.. Just remember that "living out the teachings of christ" includes being a "member of the catholic church"!.
I think bro deo's point is, christ teaches us to be catholics(which include your "catholic" and "christian" definitions) but not necessarily CFC.
(You can get more info from Catholic and protestant/other denominations discussions, for starters try www.catholic.com)
nag comment ako kasi yung definition mo ng "catholics" ay usually ginagamit ng mga hindi in full communion with the catholic church.
God bless!
Ah Men said...
comment:
The IC does not work that way, nor think that way. It has never set out to do things or say things just so that they can prove that Frank is wrong. Otherwise matagal na nila pinalabas ang 5 affidavits where the people in the center had valid complaints!!!!!!!!!
WITH THE ABOVE, I LIKE TO ASK the IC to inform all the CFC members about these VALID COMPLAINTS, HINDI e labas sa labas kung lalabas man, so be it.
DAPAT MALAMAN naman SA MGA MEMBERS, hindi ITAGAGO YAN.
CD, please ask to make an official statement from IC regarding this MATTER.
Best Regards,
Henry Liaz
CFC-Edmonton Canada
To deo volente and janeiro:
Thanks for your excellent comments.
To the rest: if we confess to be catholics, then we should follow the church's teachings as enforced by the church hierarchy. Just like if we consider ourselves members of CFC we should allow ourselves to be governed by the IC.
God bless!
A reminder to all bloggers from Metro Manila:
if you are plying EDSA, upon reaching San Carlos Seminary look at what's posted on the wall!
you'll know what i mean
To Bro. Janeiro who said:
"....nag comment ako kasi yung definition mo ng "catholics" ay usually ginagamit ng mga hindi in full communion with the catholic church."
I 1000% agree on what you have said. Maybe my definition of "catholics" were used by some who were not in full communion with the Catholic Church, i stand to be corrected on that. Thank you, since i did not know that this definition was already used by some people who are half-baked catholics.
But on my part as a 100% catholic and grew up in a Catholic Faith and also active in Catholic activities in my parish, I can say that my being a Catholic becomes more real and deep when i joined CFC and do GK.
I think even the Catholic Church would like his flock to be a faithful who live out the spirit of the gospel rather than law abiding catholics.
To end this, i just want to simply say, I feel proud and honored to be a catholic, when i see Fr. Ben Nebres, in his old age carries hollow blocks and mixing cement, a bishop, who goes house to house to visit his flock, a priest who will not walk out if the bride is late in the wedding, a priest who hears confession of a CFC member even his bishop do not accept CFC in his diocese, those priest who were abducted by rebels yet remain faithful to their vocation, a nun like mother theresa, and our Pope who went to the most anti-life nation and accept the welcome of the most anti-life president in the world.
Bros and sis, you know what i meant when i say what i desire for myself as a Christian and not only a mere "catholic". The personalities i have mentioned, as for me are genuine catholics and are not just a ritualistic or ceremonial catholic.
God bless,
Bro. Mero
To Bro Henry Liaz of CFC Edmonton who said:
"DAPAT MALAMAN naman SA MGA MEMBERS, hindi ITATAGO YAN."
Bro, as for me let us just trust our elders on their wisdom whether they will spread it to the members or they will keep it to themselves.
When we hear, news from the media against our community, try to defend ur community in the best of your ability but not forgetting to do it in a loving manner. I believe we are free to express our opinions.
But allow also our leaders and elders to do their part in the way they think is right. As for me, when an issue is not discussed with us in the lower rank, then we accept that it is not a serious matter that we need to know at pag-aksayahan ng oras, no matter how destructive the news is in the public and in media, in that way we keep our own house intact and whole.
Too much chismis is dangerous to our spiritual health. dba? So moderate your eagerness to know the complaints. Tawa naman kayo diyan. Anyway, lalabas din yan sa tamang panahon, as for me, i do not know what are those affidavits and complaints, but i pray na hindi na lalabas yun so my respect for those people involved will remain.
God bless,
Bro. Mero :-)
Hey fellow members of CFC!
I would like to inform you that there is an on-going exchange of messages responding to ABS-CBN's Online interactive survey question: "Do you approve of Vatican's admonishing Gawad Kalinga...?"
I saw it this morning an I am glad that we have Deo Volante and others defending CFC.
Go see it for yourself. Its another forum to defend CFC.
After Joe Tale on DZMM Teleradyo last Sunday (4/20), it was TV time too for Tony Meloto on 'Korina Today' last night (4/23). Both stations are ABS-CBN's by the way.
In the same TV program, Bishop Bacani told Korina that he was/is pro-FFL (oops there goes another.....supporter joining the minority!) but that he said too that he considers the letter from Cardinal Rylko not as an admonition but a 'call to dialogue'.
I think if that was the purpose of of Vatican, it would have worded its letter in plain and simple terms.
Bishop Bacani also talked of 'Unity'. If by unity he meant FAP and his minority team members will be members of CFC again, that to my mind is a pipe dream! So sorry Bishop!
SCANDAL AND THE CROSS
In the book, Crossing the Threshold of Hope, His Holiness Pope John Paul II says,
“... God is not someone who remains only outside of the world, content to be in Himself all-knowing and omnipotent. His wisdom and omnipotence are placed, by free choice, at the service of creation. If suffering is present in the history of humanity, one understands why His omnipotence was manifested in the omnipotence of humiliation on the Cross. The scandal of the Cross remains the key to the interpretation of the great mystery of suffering, which is so much a part of the history of mankind. (underscoring supplied)
Even contemporary critics of Christianity are in agreement on this point. Even they see that the crucified Christ is proof of God's solidarity with man in his suffering. God places Himself on the side of man. He does so in a radical way:
"He emptied himself,
taking the form of a slave,
coming in human likeness;
and found human in appearance,
he humbled himself,
becoming obedient to death,
even death on a cross."
(Phil 2:7-8)
Everything is contained in this statement.”
COMMENT:
Vatican has labeled GK’s partnerships with pharma companies producing contraceptives as scandals. Despite the temptation to make justifications to the contrary, including having Padilla nailed also (idamay lang pud unta siya) being the co-originator of those scandals, CFC-IC’s Joe Tale could only say, “Masakit...”, accept full responsibility, and assure full compliance with the order for public apology.
A good number of the Catholic faithful in CFC may now be seriously pained to countenance this whole situation...trying hard to think through this “crucifixion of CFC” vis-a-vis that “scandal of the cross”.
CK, I think this “crucifixion of CFC” may not be as redemptive...because the cry for objective truth and justice is coming through LOUD AND CLEAR...
Friends, terribly sorry to disappoint...much as we try, we may not really lovingly embrace this kind of cross that CFC is now carrying, and our drawn swords must be waged openly against the Enemy, instead of prying and hurting us further inside, unlike that spear that drew Living Water, as it pierced the insides of that Man on the “scandalous” Cross...
LORD GOD, HELP US. PLEASE LIGHT OUR WAY!
Following is a comment of a certain ROLarena, 4/24/08 in the ABS-CBN Online Interactive page.
I wanted to reply to it but I do not know how to handle it w/o assistance, so paki forward na lang it okay ROLarena sa ABS-CBN online interactive page.
ROLarena: “I am agreeable that Vatican admonishes GK for its "overemphasis on social work" not correction as your group is claiming (for). I'm with CFC-FFL and your invitation to rejoin your group is not in my dream.”
My comment: I and perhaps some more readers here will respect your decision. To me, my staying in CFC is not a dream, it is my life! And while fully awake and in full control of my emotional, physical, and spiritual faculties I am happy being in CFC. May your being in FFL bring you joy likewise. Enjoy it!
ROLarena: “Why should I come back to your group?
My comment: Oh no please don’t! By all means, please remain where you are!
ROLarena: “Your group is supporting GK which has so many flaws”
My comment: Yes, we agree GK has flaws and it is very subjective whether it has plenty of it or just a few. However, if you care to know, we are correcting it. And that we have not found perfection because we are still here on earth. We pray that when you personally involve yourself as the perfection-seeking ROLarena in your Restoration Villages, you will not find flaws there so you do not fall back to the ground with a big thud! Meantime dream on!
ROLarena: “….your leaders are disobedient with the recommendations given by the Bishops to avoid split of CFC….”
My comment: You used the word “recommendation” and the last time I checked the meaning of that word with the ‘New World Dictionary of the American Language’ the word means “to advise, to suggest, etc”. That’s the meaning applicable to your issue. I will pray that you as member of FFL will totally be in agreement with the recommendations of your President Frank Padilla, and that there will not be a day in the future you will be ‘disobedient’ as applied in your context.
ROLarena: “…your leaders who are only want (powers) (better use: who only want power) (no humility at all)….”
My comment: This is your personal opinion. I hesitated to give a comment, but in the spirit of giving brotherly advise, please direct your negative judgment to something more positive by praying that all leaders of FFL will never be seduced by power. I do not know if you ever had any inkling of the kind of power some of your FFL leaders wielded while they were in authority in CFC. I bet you some of them maybe missing it badly.
ROLarena; “….your leaders who can not show financial statements of GK (fundings) - no transparency at all - we don't know what happen to the millions of pesos solicited only that GK built houses. What were the real expenses?);
My comment: What’s EXACTLY your beef, brother? I suggest you communicate with Bro. Mike Goco, Director of Finance of GK (0918-918-46-26) or Bro Luis Oquinena, Executive Director of GK (0918-967-97-32) and throw to them the exact financial charge or financial wrong-doing or financial anomaly you think you know and ask them to explain. May we just request that when you do and when the two brothers prove that there is no substance to your claim, please promise to apologize to them, GK partners and GK volunteers. Deal?
ROLarena: “…your leaders tolerating wrong doings in GK villages (you know them for sure)”
My comment: Bro we will be happy to know the particulars of whatever wrong-doing is being tolerated by us in CFC, GK or even perhaps the other Ministries. It is very easy to make general fleeting statements like this Bro., but it would not help. So we all could learn from your teaching, and perhaps you could later on also apply your knowledge to your three Restoration villages, please come up with that list and let’s discuss it more intelligently. Second Deal? Call ka pa ba Bro?
ROLarena: “…your leaders by-passed the national leadership of Laity (re: Tale et al went to Vatican by-passing Bishop Reyes who is the Head of the CBCP Pontifical Commission on the Laity)”
My comment: Do you know it as fact if your President Frank Padilla asked permission from Bishop Gabriel Reyes, Head of PCL, when he went to Vatican too? An aside, why should this bother you if Bishop G. Reyes does not consider it an affront to his exalted position if Bros. JTale and RPonte met Cardinal Rylko, who by the way also gladly received them to a dialogue?
ROLarena: “Perhaps, brother it should be the other way around. You are telling that CFC is governed by its statutes. Fine, but did you follow Statute no. 942 which states that "Couples for Christ will conform to and support Orthodox Church teachings and stand on issues". Why did your so called leaders (accepted) (double past tense, better use accept after using verb did) money from drug companies that produce contraceptives which is against the teaching of Catholic Church? Perhaps, you know the answer of your leaders. Bro. Tony Meloto's answer as published in Inquirer page 23, dated Aug. 28, 2007,"GK is non-partisan. We do not take any side in building a nation in the same manner that we do not pass judgment on any corporation we engage. We do not ask them what their (corporations) products are as long as they want to help." So pera lang pala ang gusto, di ba. How can be spiritual transformation if the source of funding is not from a moral source? Meron tayong kasbihan, "Kung ano ang puno, siya rin ang bunga!" very clear ito. As father of your children, are you going to feed them goods coming from (unmoral) (better use immoral) source? Di ba hindi. It is the same analogy applies in GK (fundings) (better use funding).”
My Comment: the question of tainted money being used for spiritual or social purposes directed to the poor is a clearly un-settled issue even among the clergy. About spiritual transformation, only God can determine that and only at the end of time. While we live here, there will be days we will live, act, think, behave, speak, etc as if we are already ‘spiritually transformed’ but as you and I know it is so easy to be tempted and backslide, so lets us just pray for one another’s CONTINUING SPIRITUAL transformation.
Hindi rin ito pera pera lang Bro. Pero baka hindi mo maintindihan yung statement na yan. Sumali ka muna doon sa tatlong Restoration Villages ninyo, para malaman mo ang katotohanan ng sinasabi ko.
ROLarena: “In the future there will be one CFC and that is CFC-FFl”
My comment: Nice try Bro! One CFC is already a reality! One FFL is also a minor reality too! Those are the two facts you have to live with. They are what is know as objective truth. Of course, I can’t do anything if you would like to live under the myth of your own beliefs.
ROLarena: “Kung ako sayo brother, ikaw ang sumama sa amin. Bro. Frank Padilla is the permanent representative of CFC to Vatican by virtue of issued certication by Vatican therefore CFC-FFL is recognized by Vatican. Huwag ka namang makasarili na sinasabi mo na kayo lang ang recognize(d).
My comment: You said it and you seem to believe in it! As I said you may remain in that illusion for as long as you wish.
God bless.
PS. I have some suggestion on your English writing, you’ll find them in enclosed words or letters.
TRUTH IS NOT SWAYED BY ANY SURVEY
That ABS-CBN survey on the Vatican "admonition" of CFC may just be another spin of the Enemy. We’re not in a popularity contest here, and truth may not be compatible with it, although it can boost the bottom line of interest groups. Even if carried only by a single torchbearer, TRUTH will withstand millions and millions of views and viewers to the contrary.
That is why, I think that survey uselessly keeps us away from the real issue – no, not Cardinal Rylko nor the Vatican but FRANK PADILLA (I’ll have a separate post on this). Let’s keep the disciplined, respectable, and “CFCsque” nature of our discussions to ourselves here, na lang. It has been generally civil and spirit-filled (yea?).
While we’re at it, why not ABS-CBN conduct a follow-up or in-depth investigation of Bro. Boy Montelibano’s revelations about that pool of government funds accessed during Padilla’s time (boy, did Frank really get a hammering on the head in that article!...well, he’s the issue). Formal audit or audit results on the use of those funds have been much eagerly anticipated, I guess.
Who knows, there may be fringe benefits here! Dealing purposively with this particular issue may make them drop “CFC” from their formal ID, survey or no survey.
Mga kapatid, the ABS-CBN survey opens up a healthy dialog of the issues. I am glad that it involves members from FFL so we can also hear their side. Let us be extra careful though that we don't appear sarcastic or offensive or disrespectful as it will reflect badly on us Christian communities. Remember that ABS-CBN is mainstream media that is read by a lot of people from different demographics. We need to evangelize this people so we don't want to give them a wrong impression of us Christians. We should refrain from making accusations, otherwise we won't be too different from those who accuse us. We also need to affirm their points if they are correct. This is not about who is correct and who is wrong. It's about what is right and Christ-like according to our opinion, presented in a humble and gentle manner.
God bless us all.
bro deo volente,
Binasa ko kanina yung abs-cbn forum. Thanks for taking up the cudgels. Bulls-eye lahat ng sinabi mo bro but in an admirably charitable way, ang galing. Someone is using you. God bless!
i agree with Deo Volente, leave the REAL CFC here (sarcastic, offensive and disrespectful).
Hindi ko maintindihan kung bakit ang mga brothers natin sa FFL, nakikigulo sa mga usapan ng CFC. Why not leave us alone. Kung FFL members kayo, eh di, okay... If you believe that FFL is good, okay, PLEASE lang....leave CFC alone.
WE HAVE A CHOICE
I work at an investment firm. If I don't like the way they do business or if I don't agree with their practice or if the way they do business conflicts with my faith and what I believe in -- I have the option to resign and quit my job. I can do that. Nobody is forcing me to be there. In the same manner that we can also make it known that we can "choose" the source of the resources or donations that comes to GK.
People will argue and say: "...should all Christians who work in pharma companies that manufacture anti-life products resign then?". You see, they have a choice -- they can, if they want to. They have a choice.
Another would go and say: "...shoud we ask everyone that goes to Church then if they support anti-life products?". Brothers and sisters, there are things that are beyond our control - but for those things where we have prior knowledge and can take action - we can't just sit idle and not do or say anything. We have a choice. In case we have forgotten, GK IS NOT ABOUT THE MONEY! It was never about the money. Because that would be very sad if it was. In our eager desire to build more, we should never compromise our identity as Christians.
EVANGELIZATION
Evangelization is still 1st. Why? because Jesus Christ said so. We can build all the gazillion houses we want, we can alleviate the poor from their physical oppresion, from their pysical sufferings -- but if people don't even get to know and accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior, then what EXACTLY DID WE BUILD? People are dying every day -- and what's sad is, they don't even get to know Christ.
And I will say this with no apologies to anyone: There is no amount of social work on the face of the earth that can save a man's soul. None. It is only in accepting the Gospel of the Lord that we are saved - Jesus Christ already died for us. It is by the grace of God that we are able to do the work for the poor - and Jesus commands this and that's why we do it. But it should never, ever overwhelm us and our first call as desciples of Christ - to proclaim His Word and the good news of salvation. That we should always humble ourselves and RETURN THE GLORY TO GOD. That GK should not be associated with a human face but that of the face of God. That when people hear of GK, the first thing that comes to their minds: "Yes, this is the work God. Jesus Christ is present here!"
And lastly, anything, and everything and anyone that will prevent me or will infringe my call to spread the Gospel and to proclaim the good news of Christ's salvation - CANNOT BE THE WORK OF GOD.
There are no grey areas here. God bless everyone.
-Jacobo Pumaling, Northeast, GK Advocate
Brod Deo:
I want to honor you for your expressed self-restraint in the matter of exposing "our side as CFC" in ABS-CBN's "unbriddled" forum.
Here in IDOTRCFC, we know that this is clearly in defense of the original CFC versus the renegades or dissidents who have formed and/or joined FFL. At ABS-CBN, it is a differet ballgame altogether, I suppose.
I think this is part of the scenario I have dreaded when I foresaw the effect of (a) that sorry invitation for Vatican to join the fray (a local labu-labo that media may readily expoit for a heftier bottom line), and (b) that riled disposition of Bro. Tony Meloto who seriously challenged our Church to make a clear, definitive position on social work (in the context of the alleged scandals in GK) for guidance of the Catholic faithful.
THEY have opened the floodgates...I pray that none among us in the original CFC gets to drown in that fearful deluge...We pray, in Jesus Name. AMEN.
Bro. Joe Tale said, "Masakit..." referring to the CFC cross of scandals. There's more to it as we see our common bonds, even our culture, too, being "dirtied" or beaten away by the "merons", pretenders, etc. in an open forum like the one now hosted by ABS-CBN.
Much as I must also uphold the "Cartesian" principle of free speech in tandem with our present predicaments in CFC especially that we practice the same freedom here in IDOTRCFC,I will still caution RESTRAINT, like our Bro. Deo here is doing, and if it was OK, dito na lang sana ang free-wheeling na usapan sa "ating bahay" ...
Do keep up the fight of our faith, Bro. Deo. God Bless us all! Good Day, Brother.
Well, eto nanahimik ako nang matagal, pero hindi rin ako puedeng manahimik ngayon. Alam ko na ang puso nang mga gumagawa nang trabaho nang GK ay maka-Kristo; pero ang mga lider nila? nagpagamit kayo sa kalaban. Accusation ba yon? oo, accusation! Meron kayong na-prove, na hindi tayo natuto sa mga kasalanang natin noon. Ako ngayon ay naghahanap nang bayani, BAYANI PARA KAY KRISTO na mapaniniwalaan ko dahil ang isip, puso, salita at gawain nila ay binigay nila sa KANYA na nagbigay sa atin nang GK para ALAGAAN natin, hindi sirain... Naghahanap ako nang Kapatid na nagmamahal at naggagalang sa Simbahan...Naghahanap ako nang KRISTIYANONG LIDER NA BAYANI nang magbibigay nang buong buhay (heart, soul and mind) para sa Diyos una, sa pamilya pangalawa, at sa kapwa mamamayan, pangatlo. Nasaan na sila? Siguro nandoon sila nagtatrabaho sa Bayani Build, siguro nandoon sila nag-C-CLP, siguro nandoon sila sa simbahan pinagdadasal at humihingi nang patawad sa Diyos sa mga sinasabi natin dito sa blogspot na 'to. MAHIYA NAMAN TAYO at inilantad natin ang basura nang puso natin para makita nang lahat at ang masakit pa…tumahimik lang tayo, pinabayaan natin na maglantad ang mga kapatid natin…Salamat sa mga paalala Deo Volente, Joni, CD, sleepless, Jacobo, pati na rin ang mga anonymous na kapatid natin sa FFL…may nakikinig ba?
So here I am, keeping quiet and minding my own business for a while, but I can’t stay quiet anymore. I know that the heart of the workers for GK are for Christ; but their leaders? They have allowed themselves to be used by the enemy! Is that an accusation? YES, that’s accusation. You have proved one thing, that we have not learned from past mistakes. I now am looking for a hero, A HERO FOR CHRIST whom I can believe in because I see their mind, soul, words and actions are for HIM who gave us GK to take care of, not destroy. I am looking for a brother or a sister in Christ who loves and respects the Church. I am looking for a CHRISTIAN heroic leader who will give their whole life (heart, soul and mind) to God first, their family second and their country third. Where are they? Perhaps they are all working at the Bayani Build; perhaps they are conducting CLPS; Perhaps they are in adoration and in church praying for us and asking God to forgive us for what we are writing here. Shame on all of us for airing our dirty laundry and hearts in public for all to see. What hurts the most, is we kept quiet, we didn’t say a word, we allowed our brothers and sisters to speak ill of others. Thank you for the reminders Deo Volente, Joni, CD, Sleepless, Jacobo and yes, even our anonymous brethren from FFL…IS ANYBODY LISTENING?)
THIS IS IT!!!
WECOME THE NEW BEGINNING!!!
PSALM 1914, it is very good to have you back!
You were the one who vigorously focused this forum to the cross early on, a “royal” voice directing the loving embrace of the Tree as the only way to our healing in CFC.
I have opined earlier that “the scandals hanged with CFC on the cross” might not be as redemptive as “‘the ‘scandal’” of a God hanging on the cross” because a revolting spirit rages among those who may not agree with the Vatican verdict, and who insist that the objective truth be upheld and justice likewise rendered.
Yet, how is it now that there is this Other VOICE that says, “It is better to be loving than to be correct!” I feel personally guilty that I silently cheered for the coming annihilation to kingdom come of all those responsible for this sordid mess, especially that all types of vested interests appeared like scrambling for the blood of a stirring and pained Mystical Body of Christ in the Philippines.
God is making a way...
He can inspire us all to look closely and embrace our CFC Cross that is now laced with the alleged scandals;
He can call us to be gentle with our brothers sisters in FFL
(Believe me, until I read that appeal from an FFL follower, my mind and heart was focused on putting Padilla on the firing line as the main issue. NoW, this does not matter anymore and I am ready to forget everything, and get from the blacksmith those plowshares made out of swords. At issue now is our individual struggles to bring Christ and our crosses into ourselves, as we embrace our own mistakes and shortcomings, and open ourselves to understand and re-create our lost loving feelings as Couples for Christ).
CD, Everyone, Brothers and Sisters! God is certainly preparing us to bathe in the Living Water from His pierced body. Let us counsel forgiveness, forgiveness, and forgiveness. And as we do this, let us allow those FFL trumpets to blare and blaze out to melting point ALL areas of contention between CFC and FFL...
WHY is this? Frank Padilla has called his followers to make their own defenses that as a whole will constitute his total defense. His vital defenses have cracked as Vatican shuts out his international links. That he now leaves everyone to fend for himself is certainly ominous...
We cannot claim to be victorious over our brothers and sisters. We only assert our common and original unity in Jesus Christ, our King.
We call this the celebration of the victory of the Kingdom of God in our hearts, of our Brother and Sisterhood in the Couples for Christ community!
YES! GOD BLESS!!!
One of the charges against IC, as I read on this paper, is that they conducted a witch hunt on Lachie.
Puzzles me! Lachie was an IC member and so why would he be a subject of a witch hunt?
Was he hiding a witch?
or was he bewitched?
But I hear of ghost stories at the second floor of the Center...so it should NOT be surprising if there were witches too!
[cd I think you will not post this]
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